use of CSL styles in Peaya with changed attribution

Peaya Cite (http://www.peaya.com/peaya.php) has some nice features for citing within Word that Zotero doesn’t currently provide. To generate its citations ships with a folder full of CSL styles that were presumably obtained from the Zotero repository. This fact alone doesn’t concern me; styles want to be free.

I am more concerned with what seems to have happened to the “author” and “contributor” elements in each of these styles, and, to a lesser extent, the proliferation of a bunch of style IDs that refer to the same style. The styles I have looked at are verbatim or nearly verbatim copies of the Zotero styles with changed IDs and links. In every case, the author is listed as

Valerie Song
valerie@peaya.com

Sean has attempted to email Ms. Song, but unfortunately her email address does not appear to be valid.

For some styles, this is merely unethical and ambiguously illegal. However, Richard’s styles still include the CC tag

This work is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-Share Alike 3.0 United States License: http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/us/

although Peaya Cite has violated this license by removing the attribution.

While we’re on this subject, I think that there’s an additional question of what will happen as CSL begins to proliferate throughout commercial products. Will commercial developers who create their own CSL styles to supplement the styles that they have acquired from the repository keep those styles behind locked doors, or make those styles freely available for all to use? I would hope the latter—the amount of effort that Peaya, Mendeley, and others have saved by relying on open source styles likely far exceeds the amount of effort that they are likely to invest in creating their own, and giving back to the community seems like the right thing to do. But, short of moral obligations, I’m not sure if there’s anything we can do to make sure this happens.

Simon

Peaya Cite (http://www.peaya.com/peaya.php) has some nice features for citing within Word that Zotero doesn’t currently provide.

One of the features (contextual hinting; which I’d like to see) is
clearly reminiscent of (though more limited than) this post of mine:

http://community.muohio.edu/blogs/darcusb/archives/2004/05/26/dashboard-and-remembrance-agent

To generate its citations ships with a folder full of CSL styles that were presumably obtained from the Zotero repository. This fact alone doesn’t concern me; styles want to be free.

I am more concerned with what seems to have happened to the “author” and “contributor” elements in each of these styles, and, to a lesser extent, the proliferation of a bunch of style IDs that refer to the same style. The styles I have looked at are verbatim or nearly verbatim copies of the Zotero styles with changed IDs and links. In every case, the author is listed as

Valerie Song
valerie@peaya.com

Sean has attempted to email Ms. Song, but unfortunately her email address does not appear to be valid.

For some styles, this is merely unethical and ambiguously illegal. However, Richard’s styles still include the CC tag

This work is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-Share Alike 3.0 United States License: http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/us/

although Peaya Cite has violated this license by removing the attribution.

While we’re on this subject, I think that there’s an additional question of what will happen as CSL begins to proliferate throughout commercial products. Will commercial developers who create their own CSL styles to supplement the styles that they have acquired from the repository keep those styles behind locked doors, or make those styles freely available for all to use? I would hope the latter—the amount of effort that Peaya, Mendeley, and others have saved by relying on open source styles likely far exceeds the amount of effort that they are likely to invest in creating their own, and giving back to the community seems like the right thing to do. But, short of moral obligations, I’m not sure if there’s anything we can do to make sure this happens.

Yeah, it just raises again a few issues, mostly centering on the csl
editor that Mendeley is working on, and that I wish all of could find
more time to pay attention to.

  1. I sent a bunch of list posts that all centered on our goals for
    this project (do we consider it a priority to make it easier to edit
    styles? who gets to edit them?), and criteria we might use to assess
    design questions and such (how do we measure a successful design
    featue?). To date, I’ve gotten zero response, which is frustrating. If
    we can’t talk about goals and metrics, then we have a sure recipe an
    unsuccessful project.

  2. The editor and repo question brings us back to licensing issues. I
    suggest we only allow styles be licensed under terms consistent with
    our goals (which has to be to enable reuse freely primarily).

  3. Related, I’m still wondering if along with this process, we want to
    get specific about the sorts of distributed style vision I’ve been
    talking about since the beginning, but which is very different than
    what we’re seeing now: vendors just dumping hundreds of files in a
    directory and shipping them as part of the download. E.g. with
    examples like Peaya, they’re just thinking of these like static files,
    rather than constantly updated objects created and maintained by a
    community.

Frank also noted, BTW, that Sente is shipping CSL styles too. But in
that case, they have their own internal style model, and they convert
CSL to those. I wrote them, and they had some good reasons for not
wanting to be very high-profile about the CSL support ATM. They were
also interested in participating in CSL development if we had a “more
open” process (I explained they it is now open).

All of this is to say that it’d be really nice if we could get
everyone on the same page here. I guess the first step has to be to at
least start the conversation.

Bruce

While we’re on this subject, I think that there’s an additional question of what will happen as CSL begins to proliferate throughout commercial products. Will commercial developers who create their own CSL styles to supplement the styles that they have acquired from the repository keep those styles behind locked doors, or make those styles freely available for all to use?

Reading this page is definitely not encouraging:

http://www.peaya.com/cite/styles/

To quote:

Please let us know (support@peaya.com) if you need the style file for a specific journal. We will create one for you as soon > as possible.

After you receive the file, save it to the CSL folder in Peaya Cite’s program folder. (It is C:\Program Files\Peaya Cite\CSL by default)

Ugh. So you email them, they create a style (invariably based on work
done in the CSL/Zotero community), and then email it back to you.

Come up people; it doesn’t have to be like this!

Bruce

Loosely inspired by this:

http://community.muohio.edu/blogs/darcusb/archives/2010/07/07/csl-status-and-next-steps

Bruce

Sean has attempted to email Ms. Song, but unfortunately her email address does not appear to be valid.

I have sent an email to her address & to the ‘support@peaya.com’ address
given on their contact page:
http://www.peaya.com/peayapaper/contact/
and to abuse@peaya.com for good measure. For now, I’ve asked only that
attribution be restored to all files and have also pointed them to this
mailing list so that they might offer to contribute to the discussion
and development of CSL.

–Rick

  1. Related, I’m still wondering if along with this process, we want to
    get specific about the sorts of distributed style vision I’ve been
    talking about since the beginning, but which is very different than
    what we’re seeing now: vendors just dumping hundreds of files in a
    directory and shipping them as part of the download.

From our side, I’m hoping that we’ll move away from doing that soon.
I know the eventual plan was to have a style repository online with a
suitable web service API,
if I remember correctly, the discussion did not get as far as the
specific features that such a web service would need to provide and a
draft API?

Regarding the style editor, we got sidetracked a little by other
deadlines last month. Will try to get back to you on that shortly.

Regards,
Robert.

if I remember correctly, the discussion did not get as far as the
specific features that such a web service would need to provide and a
draft API?

I think we only talked in the vaguest of terms about this.

Regarding the style editor, we got sidetracked a little by other
deadlines last month. Will try to get back to you on that shortly.

No problem; thanks!

Bruce

Sean has attempted to email Ms. Song, but unfortunately her email address does not appear to be valid.

Her email address should now work. I don’t know if she is a list
member yet, so I’ve CCed her.

To her credit, Valerie Song put the attribution back into the CSL
files by around midnight PST. She’s apologized and has stated that
styles she makes will be freely accessible to the public (and, indeed,
some of the styles that seem to be unique to Peaya Cite are licensed
with cc-by-sa).

I have not checked the CSL files closely yet. My full information has
been restored to many of the independent styles that I remember
contributing to (none of the dependent ones, but these files are
trivial & many probably not point to a different style id).
Contributors have also been restored to at least some files that I did
not contribute to (most (all?) of which did not specify cc-by-sa) also
have the original contributors returned.

I noticed that some of the style files that are distributed with Peaya
Cite do not validate (e.g. “contributor” is misspelled as
"contributir" in a style).

Some have id elements that use the original zotero.org URIs (despite
at least minor changes to most of those files). Some have id elements
that use peaya.com. These peaya.com URIs are 404s right now; it seems
the only place to get styles from PeayaCite may currently be in their
installer. Some of the styles with peaya.com URIs seem to be unique
to peaya, but others are in the Zotero SVN.

Bruce wrote:

  1. Related, I’m still wondering if along with this process, we want to
    get specific about the sorts of distributed style vision I’ve been
    talking about since the beginning, but which is very different than
    what we’re seeing now: vendors just dumping hundreds of files in a
    directory and shipping them as part of the download. E.g. with
    examples like Peaya, they’re just thinking of these like static files,
    rather than constantly updated objects created and maintained by a
    community.

    Reading this page is definitely not encouraging:

http://www.peaya.com/cite/styles/

I agree. Perhaps Valerie can comment on the viability of installing
and updating styles via a network connection in the future and can
peruse the past discussion of shared/configurable directories for CSL
files:
http://xbiblio-devel.2463403.n2.nabble.com/CSL-installation-was-Re-xbiblio-devel-Digest-Vol-38-Issue-22-td3693570.html

Also: should we try to prevent the explosion of URIs for styles that
are virtually the same? If so, what do we need to do?

–Rick

Sean has attempted to email Ms. Song, but unfortunately her email address does not appear to be valid.

Her email address should now work. I don’t know if she is a list
member yet, so I’ve CCed her.

To her credit, Valerie Song put the attribution back into the CSL
files by around midnight PST. She’s apologized and has stated that
styles she makes will be freely accessible to the public (and, indeed,
some of the styles that seem to be unique to Peaya Cite are licensed
with cc-by-sa).

Yes, she contacted us off-list as well (I should have noted that!).

[…]

Bruce wrote:

  1. Related, I’m still wondering if along with this process, we want to
    get specific about the sorts of distributed style vision I’ve been
    talking about since the beginning, but which is very different than
    what we’re seeing now: vendors just dumping hundreds of files in a
    directory and shipping them as part of the download. E.g. with
    examples like Peaya, they’re just thinking of these like static files,
    rather than constantly updated objects created and maintained by a
    community.

    Reading this page is definitely not encouraging:

http://www.peaya.com/cite/styles/

I agree. Perhaps Valerie can comment on the viability of installing
and updating styles via a network connection in the future and can
peruse the past discussion of shared/configurable directories for CSL
files:
http://xbiblio-devel.2463403.n2.nabble.com/CSL-installation-was-Re-xbiblio-devel-Digest-Vol-38-Issue-22-td3693570.html

Also: should we try to prevent the explosion of URIs for styles that
are virtually the same? If so, what do we need to do?

One thing to keep in mind is that I believe our intention is to move
1.0 versions of the zotero styles to citationstyles.org, and to host
the new CSL editor there (when it’s ready). If we do that right, that
ought to provide some incentive to resolve some of these issues.

But beyond that, it’s definitely a bad idea to fork styles. If you
make changes to them, then contact the person that created the
original style and see if they might fold them in. It would be a bad
thing to end up with ten different APA style files, each trivially
different.

Bruce

I agree entirely. As I noted on the Zotero forums about 5 minutes ago, I’m planning on sending out an email later today asking all style authors and contributors to license their contributions under CC-BY-SA, to clarify the distribution rights that apply to the styles and to ensure that any modified versions remain free for all to use. If there are any objections to this plan, please let me know.

Simon

Sean has attempted to email Ms. Song, but unfortunately her email address does not appear to be valid.

Her email address should now work. I don’t know if she is a list
member yet, so I’ve CCed her.

To her credit, Valerie Song put the attribution back into the CSL
files by around midnight PST. She’s apologized and has stated that
styles she makes will be freely accessible to the public (and, indeed,
some of the styles that seem to be unique to Peaya Cite are licensed
with cc-by-sa).

Yes, she contacted us off-list as well (I should have noted that!).

[…]

Bruce wrote:

  1. Related, I’m still wondering if along with this process, we want to
    get specific about the sorts of distributed style vision I’ve been
    talking about since the beginning, but which is very different than
    what we’re seeing now: vendors just dumping hundreds of files in a
    directory and shipping them as part of the download. E.g. with
    examples like Peaya, they’re just thinking of these like static files,
    rather than constantly updated objects created and maintained by a
    community.

    Reading this page is definitely not encouraging:

http://www.peaya.com/cite/styles/

I agree. Perhaps Valerie can comment on the viability of installing
and updating styles via a network connection in the future and can
peruse the past discussion of shared/configurable directories for CSL
files:
http://xbiblio-devel.2463403.n2.nabble.com/CSL-installation-was-Re-xbiblio-devel-Digest-Vol-38-Issue-22-td3693570.html

Also: should we try to prevent the explosion of URIs for styles that
are virtually the same? If so, what do we need to do?

One thing to keep in mind is that I believe our intention is to move
1.0 versions of the zotero styles to citationstyles.org, and to host
the new CSL editor there (when it’s ready). If we do that right, that
ought to provide some incentive to resolve some of these issues.

But beyond that, it’s definitely a bad idea to fork styles. If you
make changes to them, then contact the person that created the
original style and see if they might fold them in. It would be a bad
thing to end up with ten different APA style files, each trivially
different.

I agree entirely. As I noted on the Zotero forums about 5 minutes ago, I’m planning on sending out an email later today asking all style authors and contributors to license their contributions under CC-BY-SA, to clarify the distribution rights that apply to the styles and to ensure that any modified versions remain free for all to use. If there are any objections to this plan, please let me know.

I’m a layman on IP issues, but this sounds good to me.

It’s a separate thing, but beyond the license on individual styles, it
might also be good to provide a statement on citationstyles.org to the
effect that (1) styles submitted to the repository are in principle
open to continuous revision by others, (2) that content licensed on
terms that conflict with the objectives of the repository in the view
of [insert organization name here] may be excluded, and (3) that
submitters represent that they have rights in the content (and that
the license terms stated in the file are accurate).

that content licensed on
terms that conflict with the objectives of the repository in the view
of [insert organization name here] may be excluded

I think it might be better to simply provide a license or, if
absolutely necessary, a choice of licenses and require that all styles
in the repository use that license(s) - which I think is what already
happens in the Zotero style repository? In the case of the creative
commons licenses, there are already nice simple web pages which
explain the conditions of a particular license.

Regards,
Robert.

Revisiting the topic of licensing of CSL styles: I was wondering if it would
make sense (and would be legally sound) to require that any styles hosted at
https://github.com/citation-style-language/styles should be licensed under
CC-BY-SA. Styles with a different license wouldn’t be accepted, and any
styles submitted for inclusion in the repository would automatically receive
this license if no license is set. CC-BY-SA is by far the most common
license used (there are 2 LGPL styles, 1 GPL style (!, immunity.csl) and
some styles without licenses), and settling on a single license would make
it far easier to communicate the licensing requirements to any prospective
adopters of CSL.

In related news, I recently updated the CSL schema to disallow the cs:rights
element in cs:info for dependent styles, as I think we shouldn’t bother with
licensing those (none of the existing dependent styles include a cs:rights
element).

RintzeOn Mon, Jul 12, 2010 at 5:19 AM, Robert Knight <@Robert_Knight>wrote:

I’m in favor of Rintze’s suggestion, but wonder: what would the BY clause
mean here? It’s not exactly creative work subject to copyright.

I think it might be better to simply provide a license or, if
absolutely necessary, a choice of licenses and require that all styles
in the repository use that license(s) - which I think is what already
happens in the Zotero style repository? In the case of the creative
commons licenses, there are already nice simple web pages which
explain the conditions of a particular license.

Revisiting the topic of licensing of CSL styles: I was wondering if it
would
make sense (and would be legally sound) to require that any styles hosted
at
https://github.com/citation-style-language/styles should be licensed under
CC-BY-SA. Styles with a different license wouldn’t be accepted, and any
styles submitted for inclusion in the repository would automatically
receive
this license if no license is set. CC-BY-SA is by far the most common
license used (there are 2 LGPL styles, 1 GPL style (!, immunity.csl) and
some styles without licenses), and settling on a single license would make
it far easier to communicate the licensing requirements to any prospective
adopters of CSL.

In related news, I recently updated the CSL schema to disallow the
cs:rights
element in cs:info for dependent styles, as I think we shouldn’t bother
with

http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/3.0/ :

“Attribution — You must attribute the work in the manner specified by the
author or licensor (but not in any way that suggests that they endorse you
or your use of the work).”

In our case, I guess we should require that author/contributor info may not
be modified or stripped from styles obtained from the repository. And
perhaps we could demand that any software using the styles must mention they
use CSL.

Rintze