# Styles repository - status update

**URL:** <https://discourse.citationstyles.org/t/styles-repository-status-update/1162>\
**Category:** CSL Development\
**Created:** [March 28, 2013, 3:37am UTC](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/t/styles-repository-status-update/1162 "2013-03-28T03:37:14Z")\
**Posts on this page:** 20\
**Page:** 1

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**Author:** ![Rintze\_Zelle](https://yyz1.discourse-cdn.com/flex029/user_avatar/discourse.citationstyles.org/rintze_zelle/32/175_2.png) [@Rintze\_Zelle](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/u/Rintze_Zelle)\
**Post date:** [March 28, 2013, 3:37am UTC](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/t/styles-repository-status-update/1162/1 "2013-03-28T03:37:14Z")

</div>

Hi all,

Just an update of what I’ve been up to lately:

Over the past three months or so, I’ve checked all dependent styles to  
see if I could identify their journals. I also checked if each journal  
was still active, added missing ISSNs, marked up eISSNs as such, and  
added default-locales and documentation links. This was prompted by  
the rather poor state of all the “vancouver” dependents. Simon added  
these a few years ago based on an official list  
([http://www.icmje.org/journals.html](http://www.icmje.org/journals.html)), but it’s become quite clear to  
me that this list is poorly curated. E.g., we had a whole bunch of  
styles for journals that were long discontinued (which went as far  
back as the eighties), and I must have deleted over a 100 styles. Many  
styles that had “vancouver” as the parent also needed to point to a  
different Vancouver variant or a wholly different style.  
It was rather labor intensive, but I think our dependent styles are  
now in much better shape.

Going forward, I would like to become a bit more strict about the  
dependent styles that go into the repository. I plan to write an  
extension to the CSL schema so that we can use Travis CI to check for  
additional requirements. I would like to require each dependent style  
to have a default-locale (possible exceptions for multilingual  
styles), a documentation link, and a self link. I also would like to  
disallow having two (or more) instances of cs:issn, since generally  
one should be a cs:eissn.

You might also have noticed that Charles added some Springer styles,  
which bumped us to having over 4000 CSL styles (of which 800 are  
independent). Charles has made a nice script that allows us to quickly  
create dependent styles from just a template and a CSV file with (at a  
minimum) journal titles and ISSNs (see  
[https://github.com/citation-style-language/utilities/tree/master/generate\_dependent\_styles](https://github.com/citation-style-language/utilities/tree/master/generate_dependent_styles)  
). In addition to the Springer styles, Charles and I have prepared  
metadata for over a dozen of other publishers. I hope we can get  
similar data for other publishers (maybe Elsevier?).

Finally, today I added “self” links to all dependent styles. I did  
this since Zotero 4.0 will offer automatic updating of CSL styles, and  
will follow the “self” link of styles to find style updates.

Best,

Rintze

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![Sebastian\_Karcher](https://yyz1.discourse-cdn.com/flex029/user_avatar/discourse.citationstyles.org/sebastian_karcher/32/176_2.png) [@Sebastian\_Karcher](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/u/Sebastian_Karcher)\
**Post date:** [March 28, 2013, 4:08am UTC](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/t/styles-repository-status-update/1162/2 "2013-03-28T04:08:14Z")

</div>

all sounds good to me.

> I also would like to disallow having two (or more) instances of cs:issn,  
> since generally one should be a cs:eissn.  
> just so I understand this correctly: One eissn and one issn would still be  
> OK, yes. You just don’t want two cs:issn elements - correct?

I actually asked Elsevier about availability of data on journals and  
citation styles and while they were quite nice (I just caught someone  
random on chat), they said they didn’t have it.  
It might be possible to write a script since the examples they use and the  
layout off the author-guidelines page are the same across most journals,  
but that’d be more involved.

And of course thanks for your heroic work on the dependent styles.On Wed, Mar 27, 2013 at 9:37 PM, Rintze Zelle \<@Rintze\_Zelle\>wrote:

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![Charles\_Parnot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/57b2e6/32.png) [@Charles\_Parnot](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/u/Charles_Parnot)\
**Post date:** [March 28, 2013, 9:28am UTC](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/t/styles-repository-status-update/1162/3 "2013-03-28T09:28:29Z")

</div>

This is great, Rintze, thanks so much for all the hard work! I agree with all your comments too.

Regarding the script: it’s a nice way to maintain dependent style in a more controlled way. Even if updating the journal list (in tab-delimited text files) and running the script can sometimes take longer than tweaking the one affected style, it’s still worth the extra effort, as it means better maintained dependent in the future. I wonder if this logic could be pushed further in the future, by having an even easier way to edit the dependent list without having to touch any of the XML directly. Sometimes, the best tool for the job is a spreadsheet (though Excel can be very dangerous to use, as it tends to interpret ISSN as dates).

In any case, you can all take time to look into how the script works. You can just edit the tab-delimited list of journals, and edit the template, and then run the script. CSS files are created locally, and are then ready to be copied into the CSL repo. I have just added better documentation on how that works:

[https://github.com/citation-style-language/utilities/tree/master/generate\_dependent\_styles](https://github.com/citation-style-language/utilities/tree/master/generate_dependent_styles)

Charles

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**Author:** ![Sylvester\_Keil](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/85e7bf/32.png) [@Sylvester\_Keil](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/u/Sylvester_Keil)\
**Post date:** [March 28, 2013, 10:28am UTC](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/t/styles-repository-status-update/1162/4 "2013-03-28T10:28:31Z")

</div>

Hi Charles,

The script looks great! If you come up with more complex requirements or need more flexible templates you could also use CSL-Ruby – that’s exactly the sort of thing it was written to do (generate/manipulate styles). If you’re interested I could take a look over the weekend and adapt your script to use it? Let me know.

Sylvester

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![Sylvester\_Keil](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/85e7bf/32.png) [@Sylvester\_Keil](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/u/Sylvester_Keil)\
**Post date:** [March 28, 2013, 10:30am UTC](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/t/styles-repository-status-update/1162/5 "2013-03-28T10:30:00Z")

</div>

Hi Rintze,

Thanks for your great work! I can start adding more tests for dependent styles as soon as you’re ready.

Best,  
Sylvester

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![Charles\_Parnot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/57b2e6/32.png) [@Charles\_Parnot](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/u/Charles_Parnot)\
**Post date:** [March 28, 2013, 12:35pm UTC](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/t/styles-repository-status-update/1162/6 "2013-03-28T12:35:36Z")

</div>

CSL-Ruby looks very useful, but I don’t know if it can be readily used as a replacement for what the script currently does. The placeholder strings can be anywhere in the template, and one would need to navigate all the XML elements to look for those placeholders. Or else, we would have to define what the different columns can be used for in the journal lists. The current script don’t care about the template format, and the output is only as valid as the template itself.

Charles

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![Rintze\_Zelle](https://yyz1.discourse-cdn.com/flex029/user_avatar/discourse.citationstyles.org/rintze_zelle/32/175_2.png) [@Rintze\_Zelle](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/u/Rintze_Zelle)\
**Post date:** [March 28, 2013, 4:55pm UTC](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/t/styles-repository-status-update/1162/7 "2013-03-28T16:55:46Z")

</div>

> > I also would like to disallow having two (or more) instances of cs:issn,  
> > since generally one should be a cs:eissn.  
> > just so I understand this correctly: One eissn and one issn would still be  
> > OK, yes. You just don’t want two cs:issn elements - correct?

Yes. The cs:eissn element was only recently introduced in CSL 1.0.1,  
so many existing styles used cs:issn for both the online and print  
ISSNs. It’s obviously preferable to mark the online ISSN with  
cs:eissn. Also, I don’t really care for storing ISSN-L identifiers  
(with cs:issnl), and have even gone as far as deleting these from  
styles. They haven’t really caught on as a way to replace print and  
online ISSNs, and are redundant if we already have the latter (since  
the ISSN-L always seems to match one of those two).

> Regarding the script: it’s a nice way to maintain dependent style in a more controlled way. Even if updating the journal list (in tab-delimited text files) and running the script can sometimes take longer than tweaking the one affected style, it’s still worth the extra effort, as it means better maintained dependent in the future. I wonder if this logic could be pushed further in the future, by having an even easier way to edit the dependent list without having to touch any of the XML directly.

I agree. Some ideas for further improvements:

- we have metadata for several publishers, but as journals get added,  
renamed, or discontinued, we need to update it. We could do this  
ourselves periodically, e.g. once a year (several publishers publish  
their journal metadata online). It is probably also worthwhile to  
clarify our documentation on contributing styles to let users (and  
publishers) know that we have publisher-specific metadata, and that if  
they want to add/rename/delete a style from one of these publishers,  
they don’t need to bother with touching CSL XML.
- the current script does an admirable job of creating dependents. It  
also allows us to suppress the creation of discontinued/renamed styles  
(via a “skip list”). What it doesn’t do, however, is provide a way to  
identify dependent styles from the repository that are outdated and  
should be removed. It would be enough if the script, after freshly  
generating all its dependents, would check if there are any  
script-generated dependents in the styles repository that aren’t  
present in the fresh batch (script-generated styles are easily  
identifiable via the XML comment we add to each of them). We can then  
delete those by hand.

Rintze

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![Sylvester\_Keil](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/85e7bf/32.png) [@Sylvester\_Keil](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/u/Sylvester_Keil)\
**Post date:** [March 28, 2013, 5:46pm UTC](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/t/styles-repository-status-update/1162/8 "2013-03-28T17:46:25Z")

</div>

I have put up a quick gist to illustrate how you could quickly generate a style using CSL-Ruby. Now, honestly, I have used it mostly to test existing styles so I have not added a lot of convenience methods, but these could be added very quickly. Nevertheless, there are already a few features that show how this can be useful: for example, you could load the independent\_parent of the style with a simple command. The parent would be loaded and parsed on the spot and you could make sure that certain metadata match, for example, or pull information from the related style. Furthermore, you can validate the style with one command before saving etc.

When you have a very clear template this may not help you so much, but if you want more flexibility I think there is a lot of potential there (as I said, I haven’t used it much to generate styles, but all the groundwork has been laid, it is really just a matter of adding more syntactic sugar).

Another thing is that the template is essentially one-way, whereas you can parse the generated styles again with CSL-Ruby if you want to make adjustments later on, and so forth.

Anyway, I just wanted to throw this out there, because there’s a lot of good stuff implemented in CSL-Ruby that I simply haven’t had the time to document.

Here is the gist if you’re curious:

> <https://gist.github.com/inukshuk/5265227>

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![Rintze\_Zelle](https://yyz1.discourse-cdn.com/flex029/user_avatar/discourse.citationstyles.org/rintze_zelle/32/175_2.png) [@Rintze\_Zelle](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/u/Rintze_Zelle)\
**Post date:** [March 29, 2013, 2:14pm UTC](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/t/styles-repository-status-update/1162/9 "2013-03-29T14:14:24Z")

</div>

In addition to this, we should explain to users how they can quickly  
check whether their journal is covered by one of our independent  
styles. E.g. we could write documentation with questions such as:

- Is the journal publisher by Elsevier?
- If so, does the citation format in the Instructions to Authors match  
that of Biological Conservation?
- If so, use elsevier-harvard.csl.

Et cetera. It’s basically what Sebastian already does himself.

Rintze

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![Charles\_Parnot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/57b2e6/32.png) [@Charles\_Parnot](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/u/Charles_Parnot)\
**Post date:** [March 29, 2013, 2:24pm UTC](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/t/styles-repository-status-update/1162/10 "2013-03-29T14:24:12Z")

</div>

> I agree. Some ideas for further improvements:
> 
> - we have metadata for several publishers, but as journals get added,  
> renamed, or discontinued, we need to update it. We could do this  
> ourselves periodically, e.g. once a year (several publishers publish  
> their journal metadata online). It is probably also worthwhile to  
> clarify our documentation on contributing styles to let users (and  
> publishers) know that we have publisher-specific metadata, and that if  
> they want to add/rename/delete a style from one of these publishers,  
> they don’t need to bother with touching CSL XML.
> - the current script does an admirable job of creating dependents. It  
> also allows us to suppress the creation of discontinued/renamed styles  
> (via a “skip list”). What it doesn’t do, however, is provide a way to  
> identify dependent styles from the repository that are outdated and  
> should be removed. It would be enough if the script, after freshly  
> generating all its dependents, would check if there are any  
> script-generated dependents in the styles repository that aren’t  
> present in the fresh batch (script-generated styles are easily  
> identifiable via the XML comment we add to each of them). We can then  
> delete those by hand.
> 
> Rintze

Yes, better integration with the actual repository would be nice. At the moment, all the script does is generate those styles and then one has to manually copy them into the repo.

There are in fact 3 issues with this:

- if a style has not changed, the script will still create a new style, with an updated date, and simply copying over into the repo will create a needless update. I deal with this easily for now, by just using the Github.app and quickly going through each file to spot the one that really changed, and only tick those for the commit. It works but obvisouly error-prone and it gets old quickly
- discontinued journals, as you indicate. for this, we could simply add a ‘\_discontinued.txt’ list, which is distinct from the `_skip.txt` list (as this one is for journals we are not yet sure what to do with, or maybe that are exceptions etc…).

In both cases, the script will need to look into the actual repo to manipulate things in there as well. This is the next step, and obvisouly something I was not comfortable doing automatically until it was clear we have something solid. Which I think we have at this point. Manual inspection of the result before committing the changes, and proper validation, are still necessary, of course.

Charles

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![Charles\_Parnot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/57b2e6/32.png) [@Charles\_Parnot](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/u/Charles_Parnot)\
**Post date:** [March 29, 2013, 2:24pm UTC](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/t/styles-repository-status-update/1162/11 "2013-03-29T14:24:58Z")

</div>

> In addition to this, we should explain to users how they can quickly  
> check whether their journal is covered by one of our independent  
> styles. E.g. we could write documentation with questions such as:
> 
> - Is the journal publisher by Elsevier?
> - If so, does the citation format in the Instructions to Authors match  
> that of Biological Conservation?
> - If so, use elsevier-harvard.csl.
> 
> Et cetera. It’s basically what Sebastian already does himself.
> 
> Rintze

That’s an excellent point, and in fact, we should have that kind of info in our Papers help pages as well 🙂

Charles

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![Rintze\_Zelle](https://yyz1.discourse-cdn.com/flex029/user_avatar/discourse.citationstyles.org/rintze_zelle/32/175_2.png) [@Rintze\_Zelle](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/u/Rintze_Zelle)\
**Post date:** [March 31, 2013, 1:57am UTC](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/t/styles-repository-status-update/1162/12 "2013-03-31T01:57:28Z")

</div>

I added “csl-repository.csl” to the schema repository  
([https://github.com/citation-style-language/schema/blob/master/csl-repository.rnc](https://github.com/citation-style-language/schema/blob/master/csl-repository.rnc)).  
It can be called instead of csl.rnc. It is dependent on the normal  
schema, but changes a few things. So far, it:

- forbids more than one cs:issn element
- forbids some attributes on cs:style in dependent styles (“class”,  
global options, and inheritable name options)
- forbids affixes on cs:et-al (“prefix” and “suffix”)
- requires cs:rights, set as This work is  
licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike 3.0  
License
- requires at least one cs:link element.

With regard to the last point: ideally I would have csl-repository.csl  
require one “self” link, one “independent-parent” link (for  
dependents), one or more “documentation” links, and allow one or more  
"template" links (for independents). However, this is not possible  
with RELAX NG as long as we want to allow the elements within cs:info  
to be unordered (this is because of a limitation with the "interleave"  
operator). I guess here the question is what csl-repository.csl will  
be used for. I wouldn’t want to require style contributors to use a  
specific cs:info element order, as they already have enough on their  
plate. But I already periodically reorder the cs:info elements with a  
Python script ([https://github.com/citation-style-language/utilities/blob/master/csl-reindenting-and-info-reordering.py](https://github.com/citation-style-language/utilities/blob/master/csl-reindenting-and-info-reordering.py))  
for consistency, so we could use a version that requires a specific  
element order to make sure that the styles in the repo are in good  
shape.

I cleaned up the current styles so they validate against this stricter  
schema. I didn’t add stricter tests for cs:category and  
"default-locale" since there will be exceptions in the style  
repository, and I wanted all styles to validate against  
csl-repository.csl (at least for now).

Rintze

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![Rintze\_Zelle](https://yyz1.discourse-cdn.com/flex029/user_avatar/discourse.citationstyles.org/rintze_zelle/32/175_2.png) [@Rintze\_Zelle](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/u/Rintze_Zelle)\
**Post date:** [March 31, 2013, 2:38am UTC](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/t/styles-repository-status-update/1162/13 "2013-03-31T02:38:39Z")

</div>

I forgot to add that while I was writing the extension schema, I found  
a small error in the CSL 1.0.1 schema:

> <https://github.com/citation-style-language/schema/commit/de29cfb1ed1ef1e4479022268ef9e701eec68e72>

The bug allowed dependent styles to test against the rules for  
independent styles, which made the schema more lax than it should be.  
Not a problem for CSL 1.0.1, but csl-repository.csl should be used  
together with a fixed version of csl.rnc.

Rintze

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![Sylvester\_Keil](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/85e7bf/32.png) [@Sylvester\_Keil](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/u/Sylvester_Keil)\
**Post date:** [March 31, 2013, 10:03am UTC](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/t/styles-repository-status-update/1162/14 "2013-03-31T10:03:52Z")

</div>

Why don’t we just add the requirements (as well as those you mentioned below: ordering, self-link etc.) to the tests? We can add a description and a link to the schema to the Readme stating these as mandatory requirements for pull-requests. GitHub will send each pull request and subsequent changes to Travis-CI. We could even go further, by adding a Hook that auto-responds to bad pull requests with a message reiterating the rules or something along those lines.

I have committed to many open source projects and typically, the more established they are, the more burden is placed on the person making the commit/pull request. Ideally, it should not be necessary for you (or other maintainers) to have to respond to every pull request that leaves a style in a bad shape, but only review those which pass all the repository rules.

If I remember correctly, the tests validate each style against the schema; if you can express the conditions, I can adapt some styles to be validated against the new schema, as well.

Sylvester

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![Rintze\_Zelle](https://yyz1.discourse-cdn.com/flex029/user_avatar/discourse.citationstyles.org/rintze_zelle/32/175_2.png) [@Rintze\_Zelle](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/u/Rintze_Zelle)\
**Post date:** [March 31, 2013, 12:50pm UTC](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/t/styles-repository-status-update/1162/15 "2013-03-31T12:50:06Z")

</div>

> Why don’t we just add the requirements (as well as those you mentioned below: ordering, self-link etc.) to the tests? We can add a description and a link to the schema to the Readme stating these as mandatory requirements for pull-requests. GitHub will send each pull request and subsequent changes to Travis-CI. We could even go further, by adding a Hook that auto-responds to bad pull requests with a message reiterating the rules or something along those lines.

A lot of style contributors are new to GitHub. Our instructions  
explain how to create new pull requests (which is relatively simple),  
but it’s still rather complicated to modify an existing pull request  
via the website (basically, you have to navigate to the style file in  
the contributor’s fork of the repo, in the branch used for the pull  
request; there the contributor can use the Edit button). I was hoping  
we could have contributors test as much as possible before creating a  
pull request, hence the stricter schema.

> I have committed to many open source projects and typically, the more established they are, the more burden is placed on the person making the commit/pull request. Ideally, it should not be necessary for you (or other maintainers) to have to respond to every pull request that leaves a style in a bad shape, but only review those which pass all the repository rules.

Yes. The style repo is rather unique though compared to many other  
open source projects in that we get a lot of one-off contributions  
from inexperienced users. Because of that I just think that the  
current method of manually creating pull requests isn’t going to scale  
much further. I’m also wondering how many users simple decide not to  
bother submitting their style improvements because it’s too much work.  
And, even if we have a process that only generates correct pull  
requests, the style repository maintainers will still need to review  
all the correct ones, which is going to be a significant burden if the  
repository gets even more popular. (see  
[http://www.ohloh.net/p/CitationStyleLanguage](http://www.ohloh.net/p/CitationStyleLanguage) for graphs that show the  
growth in the project activity)

But maybe I’m asking the wrong question. To stir up the discussion a  
bit: developers who enjoy the availability of CSL styles (yes you!),  
be it from BibSonomy, colwiz, Docear, Drupal’s biblio module,  
jekyll-scholar, KCite, Mendeley, pandoc, Qiqqa, or Zotero, what would  
you do if Sebastian and I stopped handling style submissions? So far,  
only Charles Parnot from Papers helps out. Do any of you have a  
process in mind that doesn’t involve relying on me and Sebastian? 😛

> If I remember correctly, the tests validate each style against the schema; if you can express the conditions, I can adapt some styles to be validated against the new schema, as well.

Some of the additional requirements in csl-repository.csl are already  
part of your test framework, but I’ll look at the ones that aren’t.

Rintze

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![Sebastian\_Karcher](https://yyz1.discourse-cdn.com/flex029/user_avatar/discourse.citationstyles.org/sebastian_karcher/32/176_2.png) [@Sebastian\_Karcher](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/u/Sebastian_Karcher)\
**Post date:** [March 31, 2013, 6:59pm UTC](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/t/styles-repository-status-update/1162/16 "2013-03-31T18:59:50Z")

</div>

Hi,

> I have committed to many open source projects and typically, the more  
> established they are, the more burden is placed on the person making the  
> commit/pull request. Ideally, it should not be necessary for you (or other  
> maintainers) to have to respond to every pull request that leaves a style  
> in a bad shape, but only review those which pass all the repository rules.
> 
> Yes. The style repo is rather unique though compared to many other  
> open source projects in that we get a lot of one-off contributions  
> from inexperienced users. Because of that I just think that the  
> current method of manually creating pull requests isn’t going to scale  
> much further. I’m also wondering how many users simple decide not to  
> bother submitting their style improvements because it’s too much work.

I think Sylvester and Rintze’s approach are really 2nd and 1st best  
solutions to the current problem.  
If we can find a way to make style submissions easier and more reliably  
correct that would be ideal. I see some issues - e.g. the fact that we seem  
to get people to correctly name styles (even though e.g. the visual editor  
mostly does that right by itself), to include ISSNs and links to style  
guides - that I wouldn’t really know how to automate. Also, things like  
checking whether a style should be a dependent style seems relatively hard  
to automate, but I’m not an expert on automation and it’s very well  
possible that I’m underestimating what can be done.

But if we can’t get this to work, I think the only sustainable way to go is  
to do what Sylvester says and increase the burden on contributors. I’m less  
apprehensive about that than Rintze. The majority of pull requests we get  
that require a lot of attention is for new styles. I’d argue that - while  
it’s obviously good to cover as many styles as possible - we now have so  
many styles that my main concern would be to improve their quality rather  
than their quantity. (that includes outright mistakes - styles not  
conforming to their style guides, incomplete styles that don’t cover all  
commonly used item types (not all styles need to cover, say, legal cases,  
but most should probably cover theses and reports), as well as things like  
poor coding of affixes that lead to incorrect output on certain data  
constellation and requires, as Andrea has pointed, a fair amount of  
processor work-arounds that aren’t actually part of the specs.)

> And, even if we have a process that only generates correct pull  
> requests, the style repository maintainers will still need to review  
> all the correct ones, which is going to be a significant burden if the  
> repository gets even more popular. (see  
> [http://www.ohloh.net/p/CitationStyleLanguage](http://www.ohloh.net/p/CitationStyleLanguage) for graphs that show the

growth in the project activity)

> 

right - and I don’t see any way around that, so this:

> But maybe I’m asking the wrong question. To stir up the discussion a  
> bit: developers who enjoy the availability of CSL styles (yes you!),  
> be it from BibSonomy, colwiz, Docear, Drupal’s biblio module,  
> jekyll-scholar, KCite, Mendeley, pandoc, Qiqqa, or Zotero, what would  
> you do if Sebastian and I stopped handling style submissions? So far,  
> only Charles Parnot from Papers helps out. Do any of you have a  
> process in mind that doesn’t involve relying on me and Sebastian? 😛

really does strike me as a rather important question. For me, the problem  
isn’t just that dealing with erroneous pull requests is a lot of unpaid  
work, but also that it’s not exactly exciting and quite repetitive for the  
most part (e.g. I mind much less looking over correct pull requests to  
improve the code).

Shifting to more near term solutions:  
I think stricter Travis conditions are a good idea.  
The other thing I’d like to see - and I assume that’s possible - is that a  
failing Travis would automatically lead to a message along the lines of  
what we’re writing manually now:  
“Thank you for your submission to the citation-styles repository.  
Unfortunately, our friendly maintenance-bot Travis tells us that there are  
some problems with you submission. Please make sure that you’ve followed  
all the style requirements [link]. Travis’s output [link] may give you  
additional clues about the problems in your submission.”

Happy egg (or afikomen) hunting:  
Sebastian–  
Sebastian Karcher  
Ph.D. Candidate  
Department of Political Science  
Northwestern University

---

<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![Charles\_Parnot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/57b2e6/32.png) [@Charles\_Parnot](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/u/Charles_Parnot)\
**Post date:** [April 1, 2013, 7:49pm UTC](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/t/styles-repository-status-update/1162/17 "2013-04-01T19:49:05Z")

</div>

I agree that with all the styles now in the repository, getting stricter is the way to go, and aiming for quality should be the goal. Being less friendly with the pull requests and asking more from the contributors is maybe unfortunate but the only sustainable way IMO.

The fact that most of the work is done by unpaid contributors is a real concern, and Rintze asks a very good question. Interestingly, and maybe it’s going to be a surprise, but I am not paid by Papers/Springer. I just continue on the side to work on some of the CSL stuff, but it’s really a side activity. I have a direct contact with the Papers people, and we receive a lot of useful feedback on issues with some styles, but we don’t have the resources to answer them all at the moment. We hope to have someone with more time on his hands to dedicate to this, though at the moment, there is no promise on that. One of the reasons I keep working on this, is that I am personally excited by the project and its achievements. I want CSL to become the de facto standard.

The idea of a grant is a great one. The project has reached a level of maturity that makes it a good candidate for that. If the project received a grant, of say $100,000, the way I would like it to be spent is to pay one person for 1-2 years to devote 100% of her/his time to writing new styles, and correcting existing ones. I am pretty sure the Papers guys would be perfectly happy to send all the feedback we have to this person 🙂

Charles

---

<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![Rintze\_Zelle](https://yyz1.discourse-cdn.com/flex029/user_avatar/discourse.citationstyles.org/rintze_zelle/32/175_2.png) [@Rintze\_Zelle](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/u/Rintze_Zelle)\
**Post date:** [April 1, 2013, 9:06pm UTC](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/t/styles-repository-status-update/1162/18 "2013-04-01T21:06:28Z")

</div>

Alternatively, we could ask Zotero/Mendeley/Papers/etc. for some  
publicity to help us attract some volunteers to help out. But since  
we’re talking about grunt work, it’s unlikely that there will be many  
takers.

Rintze

---

<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![Charles\_Parnot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/57b2e6/32.png) [@Charles\_Parnot](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/u/Charles_Parnot)\
**Post date:** [April 2, 2013, 5:00am UTC](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/t/styles-repository-status-update/1162/19 "2013-04-02T05:00:56Z")

</div>

Like giving away free licenses to style contributors? :)Sent with my thumbs

---

<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![Sebastian\_Karcher](https://yyz1.discourse-cdn.com/flex029/user_avatar/discourse.citationstyles.org/sebastian_karcher/32/176_2.png) [@Sebastian\_Karcher](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/u/Sebastian_Karcher)\
**Post date:** [April 2, 2013, 2:12pm UTC](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/t/styles-repository-status-update/1162/20 "2013-04-02T14:12:00Z")

</div>

> Alternatively, we could ask Zotero/Mendeley/Papers/etc. for some  
> publicity to help us attract some volunteers to help out. But since  
> we’re talking about grunt work, it’s unlikely that there will be many  
> takers.

yeah, I’ve thought about that in the context of Zotero translators - my  
idea would be that people can learn something while volunteering. That’s  
essentially what happened in my case. I wonder, though, if we have  
sufficiently attractive learning options available for CSL.  
S.

[Next page](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/t/styles-repository-status-update/1162.md?page=2)