# quotes

**URL:** <https://discourse.citationstyles.org/t/quotes/492>\
**Category:** CSL Development\
**Created:** [July 10, 2008, 11:10pm UTC](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/t/quotes/492 "2008-07-10T23:10:32Z")\
**Posts on this page:** 9\
**Page:** 1

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**Author:** ![Andrea\_Rossato1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e47774/32.png) [@Andrea\_Rossato1](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/u/Andrea_Rossato1)\
**Post date:** [July 10, 2008, 11:10pm UTC](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/t/quotes/492/1 "2008-07-10T23:10:32Z")

</div>

Hi,

this is the first of some formatting (and even API) questions to come.  
I feel a bit sorry to keep bothering - please feel free to stop me if  
you think I’m abusing of this list, whose traffic is been recently  
influenced quite deeply by my fingers, so to speak.

should be:

" Introduction: A Chapter Title."

“Introduction: A Chapter Title”.

or

“Introduction: A Chapter Title.”

My feeling, and my implementation is:

“Introduction: A Chapter Title”.

But Zotero has:

“Introduction: A Chapter Title.”

Andrea

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**Author:** ![Bruce\_D\_Arcus1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4bbf92/32.png) [@Bruce\_D\_Arcus1](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/u/Bruce_D_Arcus1)\
**Post date:** [July 10, 2008, 11:22pm UTC](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/t/quotes/492/2 "2008-07-10T23:22:32Z")

</div>

> this is the first of some formatting (and even API) questions to come.  
> I feel a bit sorry to keep bothering - please feel free to stop me if  
> you think I’m abusing of this list, whose traffic is been recently  
> influenced quite deeply by my fingers, so to speak.

Not a problem; that’s what it’s here for.

> should be:
> 
> " Introduction: A Chapter Title."
> 
> “Introduction: A Chapter Title”.
> 
> or
> 
> “Introduction: A Chapter Title.”
> 
> My feeling, and my implementation is:
> 
> “Introduction: A Chapter Title”.
> 
> But Zotero has:
> 
> “Introduction: A Chapter Title.”

I’m pretty sure this is locale-specific, which is why we have this  
attribute (rather than just using prefix/suffix). US English would be  
the latter; perhaps Italian is the former?

Bruce

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**Author:** ![Andrea\_Rossato1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e47774/32.png) [@Andrea\_Rossato1](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/u/Andrea_Rossato1)\
**Post date:** [July 10, 2008, 11:45pm UTC](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/t/quotes/492/3 "2008-07-10T23:45:40Z")

</div>

I don’t get what you mean. It seems to me that the issue here is  
whether quotes are within or outside the prefix-suffix couple. Is it  
that locale specific? If yes, how is it specified?

Or is the implementation supposed to choose which one to use according  
to the locale?

Bruse, I really appreciate your help and your patience. Thanks a lot!

Andrea

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![Andrea\_Rossato1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e47774/32.png) [@Andrea\_Rossato1](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/u/Andrea_Rossato1)\
**Post date:** [July 10, 2008, 11:53pm UTC](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/t/quotes/492/4 "2008-07-10T23:53:48Z")

</div>

And what if instead of

we had:

I’m quite sure in this case we agree that this one is the right one:

(“Introduction: A Chapter Title”)

which would lead me to think that

“Introduction: A Chapter Title”.

solves the first.

Andrea

PS: the more I dig into all this the more I get confused. This is why,  
while I downloaded citeproc in February 2005 the first time I’ve never  
dared to even trying thinking of implementing it!

PS: I should stick to my first intentions…😉

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**Author:** ![Bruce\_D\_Arcus1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4bbf92/32.png) [@Bruce\_D\_Arcus1](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/u/Bruce_D_Arcus1)\
**Post date:** [July 10, 2008, 11:57pm UTC](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/t/quotes/492/5 "2008-07-10T23:57:54Z")

</div>

> > > 
> > 
> > I’m pretty sure this is locale-specific, which is why we have this  
> > attribute (rather than just using prefix/suffix). US English would be  
> > the latter; perhaps Italian is the former?
> 
> I don’t get what you mean. It seems to me that the issue here is  
> whether quotes are within or outside the prefix-suffix couple. Is it  
> that locale specific? If yes, how is it specified?

If you look at Zotero’s code:

[https://www.zotero.org/trac/browser/extension/trunk/chrome/content/zotero/xpcom/cite.js](https://www.zotero.org/trac/browser/extension/trunk/chrome/content/zotero/xpcom/cite.js)

… you find this:

this.useBritishStyleQuotes = false;

I’m pretty sure when set to true (am not sure how; must be  
locale-specific settings for it?), you put the close quote within the  
period.

> Or is the implementation supposed to choose which one to use according  
> to the locale?

Yes. I suppose, though, we could add an option for this if people  
thought it a good idea?

> Bruse, I really appreciate your help and your patience. Thanks a lot!

No problem.

Bruce

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**Author:** ![Bruce\_D\_Arcus1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4bbf92/32.png) [@Bruce\_D\_Arcus1](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/u/Bruce_D_Arcus1)\
**Post date:** [July 11, 2008, 12:03am UTC](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/t/quotes/492/6 "2008-07-11T00:03:04Z")

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> And what if instead of
> 
> we had:
> 
> I’m quite sure in this case we agree that this one is the right one:
> 
> (“Introduction: A Chapter Title”)

Yes.

> which would lead me to think that
> 
> “Introduction: A Chapter Title”.
> 
> solves the first.

As I said, not really (except in the UK and similar locales) 🙂

> PS: the more I dig into all this the more I get confused. This is why,  
> while I downloaded citeproc in February 2005 the first time I’ve never  
> dared to even trying thinking of implementing it!

This stuff is a PITA.

OTOH, once you get it working, you’re done. Next time you need to  
reconfigure citation formatting, just grab an already-existing CSL  
file, or tweak one of them as you need. As more implementations get  
finished and more styles get put up on the web, we’ll all benefit.

Bruce

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**Author:** ![Andrea\_Rossato1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e47774/32.png) [@Andrea\_Rossato1](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/u/Andrea_Rossato1)\
**Post date:** [July 11, 2008, 12:16am UTC](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/t/quotes/492/7 "2008-07-11T00:16:27Z")

</div>

> > which would lead me to think that
> > 
> > “Introduction: A Chapter Title”.
> > 
> > solves the first.
> 
> As I said, not really (except in the UK and similar locales) 🙂

> **[quotation marks: U.S. v. Britain, #1](https://writingtips.wordpress.com/2007/08/29/quotation-marks-us-v-britain-1/)**
>
> Just as the British and American rules for which side of the road to drive on are different, so too are their rules for the use of quotation marks and other punctuation. In the United States: First…

I’m getting to know all that, which really sounds like an  
inter-Anglo-Saxons kind of longstanding war… maybe for contested  
colonies… I’m thinking to leave some of these issues to future  
users’ bug reports: procastination seems to be a surviving technique,  
sometimes …🙂

> This stuff is a PITA.
> 
> OTOH, once you get it working, you’re done. Next time you need to  
> reconfigure citation formatting, just grab an already-existing CSL  
> file, or tweak one of them as you need. As more implementations get  
> finished and more styles get put up on the web, we’ll all benefit.

this is why we spend our night - Europe time - on this.

'night,  
Andrea

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![Elena\_Razlogova](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c89c15/32.png) [@Elena\_Razlogova](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/u/Elena_Razlogova)\
**Post date:** [July 11, 2008, 12:19am UTC](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/t/quotes/492/8 "2008-07-11T00:19:21Z")

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Bruce and Andrea–

There are two open Zotero tickets on this issue:

[https://www.zotero.org/trac/ticket/989](https://www.zotero.org/trac/ticket/989)

[https://www.zotero.org/trac/ticket/990](https://www.zotero.org/trac/ticket/990)

So yes, a CSL option to set language for individual styles would be  
great.

Best,  
Elena

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![Bruce\_D\_Arcus1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4bbf92/32.png) [@Bruce\_D\_Arcus1](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/u/Bruce_D_Arcus1)\
**Post date:** [July 11, 2008, 1:04am UTC](https://discourse.citationstyles.org/t/quotes/492/9 "2008-07-11T01:04:54Z")

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So the question is, how do we want to do this? Add a language element  
to the metadata section/

Also, is this enough to cover this case? E.g. is quotation style by  
definition locale/language-specific? I tend to assume yes, but just  
want to ask.

Bruce